>> WE TURN TO A TOPIC THAT EVERYONE IS TALKING ABOUT, THE DANGERS AND THE POTENTIAL OF ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE.

THIS RAPIDLY ADVANCING TECHNOLOGY IS RAISING CONCERNS AROUND THE WORLD AND IS BECOMING AN UNAVOIDABLE PART OF MODERN LIFE.

DO WE TRUST IT AND HOW IS IT IMPACTING OUR RELATIONSHIPS?

THAT'S THE QUESTION OUR NEXT GUESTS ARE EXAMINING.

YASMIN GREEN IS THE CEO OF JIGSAW, A PROGRAM SUPPORTING EMERGING TECHNOLOGIES AT GOOGLE AND ANTHROPOLOGIST GILLIAN 10 GILLIAN TETT AND EXPLORING THE CHANGE IN HUMAN CONNECTION.

>> THANK YOU BIANNA AND YASMIN GREEN AND GILLIAN TETT .

>> THE TWO OF YOU HAVE WRITTEN A PIECE IN FOREIGN AFFAIRS ABOUT TRUST IN THE AI REVOLUTION.

LET ME START WITH YOU, YASMIN.

ART AI CHAT BOTS REPLACING SEARCH?

YOU ARE PROBABLY BEST PLACED TO ANSWER THAT.

>> WELL IT LOOKS AT THE EVOLUTION OF TRUST OVER TIME STARTING WITH WHEN WE LIVED IN SMALL SOCIETIES.

WE TALK ABOUT EYE LEVEL TRUST AS WE STARTED TO SETTLE DOWN AND LIVE IN LARGER SOCIETIES, WE WOULD TALK ABOUT THE EVOLUTION OF VERTICAL TRUST IN INSTITUTIONS, THE INTERNET INTRODUCED THIS KIND OF NEW TRUST PHENOMENON THAT WE CALL DISTRIBUTED TRUST AND THEN WE TALK ABOUT WHAT IS HAPPENING NOW IN THIS NEW ERA OF AI AND EVENTUALLY AGI?

AND WE ARE KIND OF EXPLORING HOW, IT'S OFTEN SAID THAT TRUST , WE ARE IN A TRUST LIST-- TRUST LIST WORLD AND TRUST HAS EVAPORATED.

AND THEN EXPORTING ANOTHER POSSIBILITY THAT TRUST HAS MIGRATED AND WE ARE LOOKING TO NEW TRUST MEANS.

>> IS THIS SPECIFIC WITH AI AND LARGE LANGUAGE MODELS OR IS IT TRUE FOR THE WHOLE INTERNET PHENOMENON AT THE MOMENT?

>> THAT SAID, THE DISTRIBUTED TRUST IS WHAT WE SAW WAS SOCIAL MEDIA AND THE INTERNET, SOMETIMES CALLED WEB 2.0.

THIS IDEA THAT YOU WOULD GET INTO A CAB WITH A COMPLETE STRANGER AND GET INTO A CAR AND RENT AND ACCOMMODATION FROM SOMEONE YOU'VE NEVER MET OR TRADE WITH PEOPLE YOU DON'T KNOW.

THAT WAS ALL ENABLED BY THE INTERNET, THE IDEA THAT PLATFORMS ENABLED US TO HAVE SOME TRUST.

WHAT IS TRUST IN THAT CONTEXT.

IT IS RELIEF AND THE RELIABILITY OF SOMETHING WHETHER IT'S TRADER TRANSPORT ET CETERA.

WE SAW SOMETHING THAT TRANSFORMED WHO AND HOW WE TRUST WITH THE INTERNET AND WHAT WE EXPLORE IS HOW THIS AI ERA, THIS ERA OF CHAT BOTS WE CAN TALK TO, THAT TALK BACK TO US THAT ARE AVAILABLE 24/7 THAT ARE PERSONALIZED AND PRIVATE, THAT IS REALLY USHERING IN A NEW TRUST ERA BE ON THAT.

>> YASMIN HAS JUST TALKED ABOUT, GILLIAN, THIS NOTION OF PEER TO BEER TRUST-- HERE TO PEER TRUST LIKE AIRBNB AND UBER.

TELL US HOW DISTRIBUTED TRUST WORKS ANTHROPOLOGICALLY.

>> WHILE I'M AN ANTHROPOLOGIST BY TRAINING AND PEOPLE KNOW THAT ANTHROPOLOGISTS STUDY CULTURE AND THEY SOMETIMES THINK THAT CULTURE IS LIKE A COPPER WEB BOX WHERE IT'S SEALED AND STATIC AND YOU CAN STACK UP CULTURES ON TOP OF EACH OTHER, THE HIERARCHY OF VALUE AND ASSUME THAT YOUR CULTURE IS THE MOST VALUABLE.

BUT ANTHROPOLOGISTS ACTUALLY HAVE A DIFFERENT VISION, THAT IT'S MORE LIKE A RIVER THAT IS SLOW-MOVING AND CONSTANTLY CHANGING WITH NEWS STREAMS COMING IN.

AND THAT APPLIES WITH THE ISSUE THAT YOU MENTIONED ABOUT SEARCH VERSUS BOTS.

THE REALITY IS THAT THE DISTRO CULTURE IS IN CONSTANT FLUX.

RIGHT NOW THE QUESTION OF WHO WE TRUST IS ALSO IN FLUX AND TRADITIONALLY ANTHROPOLOGISTS ASSUMED THERE WERE TWO AXES OF TRUST THAT GLUED SOCIETY TOGETHER.

EITHER FACE-TO-FACE TRUST LIKE EYEBALL TO EYEBALL PEER GROUP TRUST, OR WHEN GROUPS GOT REALLY BIG YOU HAD TO TRUST IN VERTICAL AXES AND LEADERS AND INSTITUTIONS BECAUSE YOU COULDN'T EYEBALL EVERYBODY.

BUT NOW, DISTRO LINKS ARE ESSENTIALLY CREATING A WHOLE NEW TYPE OF TRUST WHICH IS PEER TO PEER TRUST ON A MASSIVE SCALE.

IT IS NOT BOUNDED BY GEOGRAPHICAL PROXIMITY ANY MORE AND THAT IS REALLY AT THE HEART OF WHAT WE ARE ARGUING.

THAT OUR DIGITAL CULTURE IS SLOWLY EVOLVING LIKE A RIVER AND RIGHT NOW THAT HORIZONTAL TRUST, DISTRIBUTED TRUST IS INCREDIBLY IMPORTANT TO THINK ABOUT.

>> WHEN YOU ARE THINKING ABOUT PEER TO PEER TRUST YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT INTERPERSONAL.

LIKE HUMAN BEINGS DISTRIBUTING TRUST.

HOW DOES THAT CHANGE BY AI IN THE EQUATION?

>> HERE'S THE KEY ISSUE.

DISTRIBUTED TRUST HAS EMERGED AS A REALLY IMPORTANT PLATFORM, REALLY SINCE THE INTERNET TOOK HOLD AND THAT HAS UNDERPINNED THINGS LIKE THE RISE OF AIRBNB OR UBER OR MANY OF THE TOOLS WE USE TODAY BUT THAT DOESN'T STAY STILL, EITHER.

INTRODUCING AI INTO THIS EQUATION IS CREATING NEW FORMS OF TRUST, WHERE ESSENTIALLY YOU CAN HAVE AI ACTING LIKE THE FOUR M'S.

DIVISION HAS HISTORICALLY BEEN THAT IF A MASTER IS COMING FROM A VERTICAL AXIS BOSSING US AROUND AND TELLING US WHAT TO DO, OR YOU CAN HAVE AI AS ONE OF OUR MATES, ONE OF OUR GAIN, ONE OF OUR FRIENDS.

OR YOU CAN HAVE AI AS A MIRROR TO OURSELVES OR AS A MODERATOR, WHERE ESSENTIALLY THEY ARE USING ALL OF THE DIGITAL TOOLS AVAILABLE TO MODERATE CONVERSATIONS BETWEEN HUMAN BEINGS.

ALL THEY ALL PLAY A ROLE TODAY SO IT'S NOT A QUESTION OF WHETHER THEY ALL-- AI BUT DO WE TRUST THAT THEY ALL WILL MAKE IT EASIER FOR HUMANS TO TRUST OTHER HUMANS OR AT LEAST INTERACT WITH THEM IN A WAY THAT CAN BUILD TRUST?

>> NOW YASMIN ONE OF THE MAIN OUTLETS THAT I READ IS TIK TOK.

WE ALL USE IT TO JENS HE PROBABLY USES IT MORE THAN THE REST OF US.

EXPLAIN HOW IT CHANGES THINGS.

>> IF JENS THE CONSISTENTLY READS NEWS OUTLETS IT'S BECAUSE THEY BELIEVE IN INDIVIDUAL--.

THEY ARE FOLLOWING THAT AS OPPOSED TO THE INSTITUTION OF THE MEDIA OUTLET SO THAT HELPS YOU UNDERSTAND THE RISE OF NEWSY SOCIAL MEDIA INFLUENCES WHO ARE DELIVERING THEIR INTERPRETATION OF THE NEWS.

IT'S NOT INVESTIGATIVE REPORTING, IT IS INVESTIGATIVE OPINION AND INVESTIGATIVE REPORTING OF NEWS INSTITUTIONS, BUT THE REASON THAT SOCIAL SIGNAL MATTERS SO MUCH TO JENS HE IS BECAUSE THEY BELIEVE IN PEOPLE WHO LOOK AND SOUND LIKE THEM.

INFLUENCERS THAT GO VIRAL ON SOCIAL MEDIA, THEY SPEAK TO YOU LIKE WE ARE IN A ONE-ON-ONE CONVERSATION WITH WORDS YOU UNDERSTAND AND REFERENCES YOU UNDERSTAND AND THERE IS A TRUST, AND AUTHENTICITY.

ALMOST LIKE THE TENSION BETWEEN AUTHORITY AND AUTHENTICITY, THAT AUTHORITY USED TO TRUMP EVERYTHING IN A VERTICAL TRUST WORLD WITH INSTITUTIONS AND INCREASINGLY ESPECIALLY GENERATION Z SUBSCRIBES TO AUTHENTICITY IS A REASON TO TRUST.

>> I'M GOING TO ASK YOU TO FOLLOW UP ON THAT, GILLIAN.

NORMALLY WHEN I TRY TO GET NEWS OR INFORMATION I DO A QUERY OR A SEARCH QUERY OR A CHAT BOT PROMPT, THAT I WANT TO KNOW THE TRUTH.

I'M A TRUTH SEEKING QUERY.

BUT YASMIN SEEMS TO SAY THAT IN THE STUDY OF JENS THE THEY ARE LOOKING FOR MORE AFFIRMATION, SOCIAL AFFIRMATION MORE THAN JUST PURE TRUTH SEEKING.

>> YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT AND I THINK ANY ONE OF OUR GENERATION TENDS TO OPERATE IN THE SAME WAY YOU ARE TALKING WHICH IS TO LOOK TO EXPERT SOURCES FOR VALIDATION OF OUR IDEAS.

ONE OF THE KEY PRESETS OF ANTHROPOLOGY IS THAT YOU CANNOT EVER ASSUME THAT THE ENTIRE WORLD LOOKS AT THE WORLD IN THE SAME WAY THAT YOU DO AND ALTHOUGH WE ASSUME THAT THE IDEAS WE GREW UP WITH OUR NORMAL, UNCHANGING AND CORRECT AND EVERYONE WOULD LOOK AT THE WORLD LIKE WE DO, THINKING THAT IS A COMPLETE FALLACY IN TODAY'S WORLD NOT JUST BECAUSE WE LIVE IN AN AGE OF GLOBALIZATION BUT BECAUSE DIFFERENT GENERATIONS HAVE DIFFERENT APPROACHES.

THE REALITY IS THAT GENERATIONS HE DOES NOT TRUST EXPERTS AND INSTITUTIONS IN THE WAY THAT YOU AND I WERE RAISED TO DO.

WHICH IS HORRIFYING TO ANYONE WHO IS AN ELITE PERSON IN AN INSTITUTION OR OF OUR GENERATION.

BUT THE REALITY IS THAT THERE ARE GOOD AND BAD THINGS ABOUT WHAT'S GOING ON.

THE GOOD THING IS, IT IS POTENTIALLY VERY EMPOWERING, AND IN SOME WAYS POTENTIALLY MORE DEMOCRATIC AND YOU CAN POTENTIALLY GET A MUCH WIDER RANGE OF VOICES IN THIS TYPE OF DEBATE.

THE BAD THING IS, IT CAN MAKE IT A VERY CHAOTIC CACOPHONY OF NOISES, VERY HARD TO HAVE SERIOUS CONVERSATIONS ABOUT POLICY OR TRADE AND YOU CAN HAVE A SCOPE FOR A TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF ATTENTION DEFICIT DISORDER BUT ALSO A TREMENDOUS AMOUNT OF MISINFORMATION IN SOME CONTEXT.

THAT'S THE DANGERS.

AND NEITHER YASMIN NOR I ARE SUGARCOATING WHAT IS GOING ON OR DENYING ANY OF THE DANGERS ASSOCIATED WITH THE EXPLOSION OF AI BOTS AND THE RISK THAT TRUST GETS ABUSED.

WE ARE STRONGLY ARGUING FOR A SENSIBLE CONVERSATION TO MITIGATE THOSE DANGERS.

BUT, THERE ARE UPSIDES AS WELL TO THE WAY THAT JENS THE ARE APPROACHING THIS.

FRANKLY WE CAN ALL LEARN FROM THEM AND WHETHER YOU LOVE OR HATE IT, THE REALITY IS THIS SHIFT IS OCCURRING AND YOU CANNOT AFFORD TO IGNORE IT.

>> DOES THIS SHIFT LEAD TO MORE CONSPIRACY THEORIES?

>> YES.

THERE'S A PAPER THAT WE TALK ABOUT IN OUR OWN ESSAY THAT WAS DONE BY RESEARCHERS AT MIT AND ELSEWHERE CALLED, YOU CAN FIND IT.

DEBUNK BUT.

THEY USED LANGUAGE LEARNING MODELS AND WHERE IS THE PROMISE WE SHOULD BE INVESTING IN AS WE TRIED TO MAKE THE LLM ERA WORK FOR US AS INDIVIDUALS AND AS SOCIETY?

THEY RECRUITED FOUR CONSPIRACY THEORISTS AND GAVE THEM SOME BACK-AND-FORTH INTERACTIONS WITH A CHAT BOT AND THEY FOUND THAT AFTER JUST TWO OR THREE BACK AND FORTH, PEOPLE ON AVERAGE RECORDED HAVING 20% LESS STRONG BELIEFS IN CONSPIRACY THEORIES AND THAT THOSE EFFECTS ENDURED OVER MONTHS.

THE INTERESTING THING, PEOPLE WOULD EXPLAIN WHY THEY BELIEVED IN CHEMTRAIL'S.

I CAN SEE THE EXHAUST AND I KNOW THE GOVERNMENT AND GAUGES IN MIND CONTROL, AND THEY WENT BACK AND FORTH AND TALKED ABOUT WELL, IT'S CONTRAILS, CONDENSATION, THEY ENGAGED WITH THEM.

THE QUOTES WERE SO POWERFUL ABOUT PEOPLE'S EXPERIENCES DURING THE STUDY THAT THEY HAVE SAID I'VE NEVER HAD SUCH A HELPFUL CONVERSATION WITH SOMEONE WHO EXPLAINED IT TO ME SO WELL.

AND THAT'S BECAUSE WE ASSOCIATE THAT OTHERS HAVE AN AGENDA WHEN THEY ARE TRYING TO COMMUNICATE WITH US.

THIS IS SOME OF THE PREJUDICE AGAINST EXPERTS OR INSTITUTIONS AND THEY THOUGHT THE CHAT BOT WAS NEUTRAL.

IT WAS A SAFE SPACE FOR THEM TO REALLY HAVE BACK-AND-FORTH ENGAGEMENT.

WHAT WE TALK ABOUT IN THE PAPER IS LIKE HOW CAN WE USE CHAT BOTS?

ONE OF THE EXAMPLES WHICH IS FROM THE UNIVERSITY OF BINGHAM'S , THEY ARE USING IT TO HELP PEOPLE COMMUNICATE WHO OTHERWISE DISAGREE.

SO YOU THINK, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE MOST INCREDIBLE USES OF AI THAT IS SO INCREDIBLE IS LANGUAGE TRANSLATION.

GOOGLE TRANSLATE.

YOU CAN SPEAK TO ANYONE IN THE WORLD DESPITE NOT KNOWING THE SAME LANGUAGE.

THAT'S NOT REALLY THE CAUSE OF MOST CONFLICTS, THAT WE DON'T SPEAK THE SAME LANGUAGE, IT'S THAT WE DON'T HAVE THE SAME WORLDVIEW.

THE REASON DIALOGUE BREAKS DOWN IS THAT I DON'T KNOW WHERE YOU ARE COMING FROM AND I CAN'T EXPLAIN WHERE I'M COMING FROM IN A WAY THAT LANDS SO THE STUDY IS LOOKING AT THE POWER OF LLM 'S TO DO NOT JUST LANGUAGE TRANSLATION BUT SOCIAL LANGUAGE TRANSLATION.

IN YOUR VIEWPOINT HE EXPLAINED TO ME AND VALUES THAT I UNDERSTAND?

AND BACK AND FORTH.

>> GIVE ME A CONCRETE EXAMPLE LIKE WHAT YOU DID IN BOWLING GREEN KENTUCKY.

>> OKAY.

WELL THAT IS OUR LATEST PROJECT AT JIGSAW WHERE WE USED LLM 'S, IT'S THE FASTEST GROWING TOWN IN THE AMAZING STATE OF KENTUCKY DOUBLING IN SIZE OVER THE NEXT 20 YEARS.

THEIR JUDGE EXECUTIVE, ESSENTIALLY THE MAYOR REALIZED THIS CHANGE WAS REALLY GOING TO UPEND SOCIETY.

THERE IS NO WAY TO BRING 100,000 PEOPLE TOGETHER AND HAVE A SINGLE CONVERSATION.

THE INTERNET DIDN'T ACTUALLY DELIVER THAT FOR US.

IT DID NOT HELP US HAVE PRODUCTIVE, LARGE CONVERSATIONS, SO WE WORKED WITH LOCAL LEADERS IN KENTUCKY TO BASICALLY DO AND AI ENABLED TOWN HALL.

IN BOWLING GREEN KENTUCKY THEY HAD ABOUT EIGHT OR NINE PEOPLE ATTEND.

WHEN WE WORKED WITH THEM TO INVITE ANYONE TO PARTICIPATE IN A VIRTUAL TOWN HALL, THEY HAD 1000 PEOPLE SO 1000 TIMES PARTICIPATION.

1 MILLION OPINIONS EXPRESSED, THOUSANDS OF POLICY PROPOSALS AND WE USED AI TO HELP THE JUDGE EXECUTIVE MAKE SENSE OF IT ALL.

THE THING THAT WAS SO STUNNING OTHER THAN THE THEMES OF THE THINGS THEY WANTED WAS THAT FOR MORE THAN HALF OF THE POLICY PROPOSALS, THERE WAS NEAR UNIVERSAL AGREEMENT.

SO IT'S LIKE, WE ARE IN THIS WORLD WHERE WE FELT THAT SOCIAL MEDIA HAS NOT SERVED US IN BRINGING US TOGETHER AS PEOPLE BUT I THINK THE LLM ERA HOLDS PROMISE TO DO THAT .

>> GILLIAN, THE WHOLE NOTION OF SOCIAL MEDIA, THE DIGITAL REVOLUTION WAS THAT IT WAS GOING TO CONNECT US AND MAKE US MORE UNITED.

THAT CLEARLY DID NOT WORK.

FROM AN ANTHROPOLOGICAL PERSPECTIVE WHAT CAUSES DIVISIVENESS AND IS A BUILD INTO THESE TECHNOLOGIES OR EVEN THE BUSINESS AND ALGORITHMS, THESE TECHNOLOGIES USE?

>> THAT IS SUCH A GREAT QUESTION BECAUSE I SPENT A LOT OF TIME TALKING TO THE FOUNDERS OF TWITTER AND WHEN THEY ORIGINALLY CREATED TWITTER THEY IMAGINED IT OF BEING LIKE A SOCIETY BAR WHERE EVERYONE BUMPED INTO EVERYONE ELSE AND HUNG TOGETHER WITH A GREAT BIG HAPPY MASS AND ONE OF THE REASONS THEY HAD THAT LITTLE BIRD, TWITTER, IS BECAUSE THEY IMAGINED EVERYONE FLOCKING TOGETHER IN A GREAT BIG HAPPY GROUP SORT OF SINGING COULD BUY.

THE REALITY IS, THE MINUTE IT BECAME SO POPULAR THAT YOU HAD VAST NUMBERS ON THE PLATFORM YOU BEGAN TO HAVE MASSIVE FRAGMENTATION WHICH IS REALLY ABOUT AS FUNDAMENTAL HUMAN URGE TO HANG TOGETHER WITH PEOPLE WHO LOOK LIKE YOU AND TO CHOOSE WHO TO HANG WITH.

IN THE REAL WORLD YOU CAN'T DO THAT MOST OF THE TIME BECAUSE YOU WILL-- YOU ARE ESSENTIALLY CONSTRAINED BY GEOGRAPHY AND WORKPLACE AND SETTINGS IN YOUR GEOGRAPHY IS HANDED TO YOU AS WELL AS YOUR SOCIAL GROUPS.

BUT THE CRUCIAL THING TO UNDERSTAND ABOUT THE INTERNET IS WHEN WE GO ONLINE, WE HAVE FOR THE FIRST TIME IN HISTORY, THE ABILITY TO FASHION IDENTITY EXACTLY AS WE WANT AND TO CUSTOMIZE, TO PICK AND MIX EXACTLY WHO WE WANT TO HANG WITH AND HOW WE PRESENT OURSELVES.

IT'S THE ULTIMATE TAKE AND MIX TOOL AND PEOPLE TEND TO PICK AND MIX THEMSELVES INTO TRIBES THAT REFLECT THE REAL WORLD TRIBALISM AND ACTUALLY INTENSIFY IT BECAUSE OF THIS CUSTOMIZATION.

>> IS THAT A GOOD THING OR A BAD THING?

>> IT'S BOTH.

LIKE ALL INNOVATIONS HAVE A GOOD SIDE AND A BAD SIDE WHETHER YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT ELECTRICITY, NUCLEAR POWER, ANYTHING ELSE.

AND THE GOOD THING IS, IT FEELS EMPOWERING.

YOU CAN FIND YOUR PEOPLE ACROSS A WIDE GEOGRAPHICAL AREA SO PEOPLE IN THE PAST WHO MAY HAVE FELT QUITE ISOLATED BECAUSE THEY WERE THE ONLY PERSON IN THAT VILLAGE WHO IS LIKE THEM CAN SUDDENLY FEEL A SENSE OF SOLIDARITY.

THE BAD SIDE IS THAT PEOPLE START SELF-SELECTING INTO TRIBAL GROUPS AND BECAUSE BIG TECH IS ABLE TO CREATE AN ARCHITECTURE THAT ESSENTIALLY SENDS YOU DOWN RABBIT HOLES OF YOUR OWN CHOOSING, THAT HAS REINFORCED TRIBALISM DRAMATICALLY.

SO WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO SAY IS WE ARE NOT SUGARCOATING THE DANGERS OF WHAT'S GOING ON WHATSOEVER.

WE ALL KNOW ABOUT THAT.

WE'VE READ JONATHAN HIATT'S BOOK ON THE ACTIVE GENERATION AND ALL THE OTHER BOOKS POINTING TO DANGERS.

AI BRINGS DANGERS.

THAT IS DEFINITELY OUT THERE.

BUT THERE'S ANOTHER SIDE OF IT THAT IS, AS YASMIN SAYS, AI BOTS MAY BE MORE NEUTRAL IN A WORLD OF HUMAN TRIBALISM THAN WE REALIZE, AND THAT MAY START TO HAVE REALLY INTERESTING POSITIVE BENEFITS.

IF WE MASTER OUR USE OF AI AND BOTS RATHER THAN ARE MASTERED BY IT, MAYBE ONE WAY TO START IS INSTEAD BY SAYING ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE, WE SOUND LIKE SOMETHING-- WHICH SOUNDS LIKE SOMETHING IMPOSED ON US OFTEN FROM THE TOP, WE TALK ABOUT AUGMENTED INTELLIGENCE OR ACCELERATED INTELLIGENCE WHICH GIVES THE IDEA THAT WE AS HUMANS CAN USE THESE TOOLS FOR BOTH A SENSE OF AGENCY AND POSSIBLY EVEN FOR GOOD.

TO UNLEASH THE ANGELS OF OUR BETTER NATURE IF YOU'D LIKE RATHER THAN THE DEMONS THAT WE HAVE HAD SO VISIBLY ON DISPLAY IN RECENT YEARS.

>> YASMIN GREEN, GILLIAN TETT , THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

>> THANK YOU.

>> THANK YOU